Podcast PR Strategies for Deeper Audience Engagement with Michelle Glogovac

I love that podcasts allow us to listen to stories we wouldn't otherwise

hear, to build empathy, to gain knowledge, to

since there's so many different types of podcasts, you can be

entertained, you can laugh, you can cry, you can learn how to build a business.

With a podcast, it's a lot of

hobbyists. You know, this is a side hustle. This is something that

people are doing on the side of their full time job, so you

have to practice a lot more patience. And when a host brings on

a guest, that trust is extended to the guest.

And so a listener is going to say, well, you know, if Brett had him

on the show, then they must know what they're talking about because Brett Brett's not

gonna bring on someone who doesn't know what they're talking about. And I want to

also remind people that, you know, size is not what you should be looking

at. You need to look at the value of who's listening

because

That's good. And welcome to a new episode

of Digital Coffee Marketing Brew. I'm your host,

Brett Deister. If you could please subscribe to this podcast and all your favorite podcasting

apps, leave a five star review. It really does help with the rankings, and let

me know how I am doing. But this week, we're gonna be talking about

well, we're gonna be talking about traditional v

PR versus podcasting PR. I know it's a very interesting

little little play on things, but I think it's gonna be a very interesting

episode because PR is PR. We always need to learn new things. But with me,

I have Michelle with me, and she is the podcast

matchmaker, a podcast publicist, and host of award winning

podcast, My Simplified Life. She works with entrepreneurs,

authors, and experts hone in on their story

abilities, grow their business, and elevate themselves

as a thought leader. Her first book, how to get

on podcast debuts in well, it did did debut in

January 2024. And Michelle is a wife, mom of two,

stepmom of two, and a fur mom as well. But

welcome, Michelle, Michelle. Thank you so much for having me, Brett. I'm

excited to be here. Yes. And the first question is, all my guest is, are

you a coffee or tea drinker? Coffee.

Tea maybe in the afternoon, in the winter, but, otherwise, it is coffee,

coffee, coffee. You have any, like, specifics on what

coffee do you like, or is it just kinda give me whatever is hot or

and or cold? I prefer flavored coffee. So right

now, since we're in fall and pumpkin spice is out, it is

pumpkin it's ground coffee, but it is flavored otherwise. Usually, it's

hazelnut for the non fall, but I will buy it at

Target in bulk to the point where I can drink my pumpkin

flavored coffee until May.

That's fair. That's fair. And I gave a brief summary of your expertise and your

listeners a little bit more about what you do.

Yes. So I my clients all get on

podcast to be interviewed around their expertise.

And, you know, I've seen a lot of agency owners who

say, you know, this is the best way to sell, to promote your book, but

I prefer to have my clients go on to share their story and their

knowledge. We know that at the end of every podcast, the host is

gonna say, where can people find you? Where can they buy their book? All of

that good stuff. So the whole purpose of an interview

is to share your knowledge, to share you know, if you have a book, what's

in the book? To share your story of how you got started in your business.

Why do you do what you do? And to really tackle it from that

angle and to, you know, give people something

that they didn't know about before, something that resonates with them.

I love that podcasts allow us to listen to stories we wouldn't otherwise

hear to build empathy, to gain knowledge,

to since there's so many different types of podcasts, you can be

entertained. You can laugh. You can cry. You can learn how to build a business.

You can do anything by listening to a podcast. And

so my job is to define what those

topics are for my clients and then to create media kits,

pitch them to podcasts that align with their message, their target

audience, and then help them repurpose that content

into marketing content so that it is not finished when

the recording stops. They can utilize their shows,

their interviews in all kinds of ways with quotes, with

graphics, and promoting it across a lot of platforms

instead of simply just the podcast as a podcast host does as

well. So how does the reach for

podcast PR compare to traditional PR? Because traditional PR, you have to go

to the journalist. You have to pitch your story. You have to hope

that the journalist will actually open the email. You have to hope that they actually

read the email. Like, there's a lot of hoping and doing a lot

of research. I mean, you have to do a lot of research for the podcast

as well, but a lot more research because you have to make sure that they

are still at the place that you are pitching it to. And

if they're not, then you kinda have to go, where did I go wrong?

So, like, what is the difference between reaches?

There's a lot of similarity in that you have to do your research. You have

to make sure the show is still being produced and is active.

You know, just as the the journalist there. But one of the big differences

is that news has a cycle where you're trying

to garner that attention quickly because there's always breaking

news. There's something else that's happening in the media. So how is it that

you fit in, and do you fit in within that

timeline? You know? And if we're not talking about breaking news, maybe you're looking at,

you know, I need to get on that holiday list that they have coming out.

Well, you need to be looking at that, like, six months in advance.

With a podcast, it's a lot of

hobbyists. You know, this is a side hustle. This is something that

people are doing on the side of their full time job. So you

have to practice a lot more patience. Nobody is sitting here

pining away waiting for that pitch because there's just no one

who wants to be a guest on my show. Everybody wants to be a

guest. And so you have to practice that patience, and that's why it's

so important to personalize the pitch, to create these speaking

topics that align with what the host is trying to put out

there, and then not following up within twenty four hours.

When you're looking at a journalist or a reporter, you're following

up quickly because you need to get that story out there.

When it's a podcast, you shouldn't be following up for maybe two to

three weeks, you know, if that, because

there's the full time job. Like I said, they're doing something where they're

not sitting here going, oh, what else can I get? I I need

that email. I need that pitch. Whereas a journalist is, they

are constantly getting new stories. You know, what is it going to be?

Another difference is in the pitch itself. A

pitch to a journalist is going to be concise. You have to get right

to the point. This is what we're talking about. This is it. Whereas a

podcast pitch is longer. Here are why we

relate to you and your show, and we've listened to it. And here's a two

or three sentence bio on the client, and then here are the speaking

topics. And here's where our client's been featured. So it's a lot

more here's everything that there is so that the

host does not have to leave the email unless they're choosing

to click on a hyperlink of the name to go to the website or the

podcast that they were most recently interviewed on

versus something that's very short and concise and gets right to the

point. So those are two of the big differences along with

you know, if you're going on TV and you're being interviewed for a couple

minutes, that's it. It's a couple minutes. A podcast is

anywhere from twenty to sixty minutes. So it's much longer

form of content, and then that'll also allows you

to pull more content from it to repurpose it versus if you

only got two minutes of airtime, that was it. You know? Did you

have one good quote in those two minutes versus having sixty

minutes of a whole lot of talking in which

things can be pulled from? So those are the big differences between

traditional PR and podcast PR.

And, I do like to mention that there is something called pod fade, which

basically is people do release

their podcast episodes, but then eventually don't release their

podcast episodes and eventually does die. So there is

a vast amount of that going on the podcasting industry

specifically, plus most don't actually go beyond their third

episode. Most do. So, yeah, so if you're if

you're on episode four, you beat out the majority of other podcast.

It's so sad, and yet yet that is, you know, the statistic,

of what it is. And some some

will be on forever. I'm on episode I think I oh, I just

released two forty five this week.

So it it's crazy, but you have to look and

see, you know, are they still active, active, and when was the most

active episode? Was it a month ago? And if it was

a month ago, was that month because they only release one per

month? You know, how consistent are they? So those are

definitely things that need to be looked at. And, I mean, what are the

unique advantages of podcast PR offer

building a personal connection with the audiences? Is it just is

it just basically, like, being, the audience being aware of

you now, or is it more than that? More than that because they get

to hear your voice. You were literally in their ear. You get

to share your story. You get to share your knowledge,

and there's also the trust factor. You know, people are

listening to podcasts that they trust. They show up

every week listening to that host, that episode, because

they enjoy it. They wanna hear more of what that host is putting out there.

And when a host brings on a guest, that trust is extended

to the guest. And so a listener is going to say, well, you know, if

Brett had him on the show, then they must know what they're talking about because

Brett Brett's not gonna bring on someone who doesn't know what they're talking about. So

that trust is automatically given to you instead

of a cold call where you're sending an email out saying, hey. Do

you wanna work with me? And you know nothing about me, and they're just words

on a screen. Somebody's listening now to you

telling what you know, telling the story of why you started

your business. You get to really be yourself, and they get

to know you by listening to this conversation. And so that

that's a really big deal. That's a gift in my

opinion. And that's why, you know, being a podcast guest

is is so worthwhile because you remove these

barriers, and you also have that trust extended to you from the

get go. And speaking of

costs, since everybody is very worried about how everything costs

these days, what is the cost between a podcast PR

campaign and traditional PR campaign? A

podcast campaign is going to be less expensive than

traditional, and the results are going to be better with a

podcast, tour per

se, because, you know, we we can't guarantee anything. Anyone who

says either traditional or podcast, I guarantee

this, don't do it because nobody can guarantee. I can't

guarantee that, you know, well, I've been on Brett's show, so I know he's going

to take my pitch for this next guest. I can't guarantee that

because I'm not the host of this show. So don't look

for a guarantee because that's not okay.

When we look at podcasts, what I say is I will guarantee

you a certain amount of interviews. And so that means

that we're going to work as hard as we can and as hard as possible

to secure those interviews. We don't

we don't guarantee size audience sizes, but we will give you all of

the stats behind the show that we have access to.

And I want to also remind people that, you know, size is not

what you should be looking at. You need to look at the value of

who's listening. Because if you come on to a show

where your job is all about marketing and we're talking about marketing

and maybe there's 500 listeners, that's perfect

because we want to talk to the marketers versus if you just went on a

show that was aimed at auto mechanics and there were a million

mechanics that were listening that don't care about marketing, then what is

the point? You'd rather get to targeted 500 listeners

versus a million who just aren't interested. So those are things to

all, you know, pay attention to as well. And a podcast, you

you get that targeted audience versus traditional media. You

might have somewhat of a target depending on, you know, are you going to a

certain magazine that focuses on your audience,

maybe, or are you on a TV show that you don't know who's watching? And

it could be a lot of different people that the target audience is not

there. So be prepared also to invest, you know,

anywhere from podcasts. There are agencies that might charge

500 to 5,000 a month. A PR company

for traditional PR is going to be multiple thousands,

5, 10, 15, up to a hundred thousand a month. So there are

big differences. I wish I was charging a hundred thousand a month.

I wouldn't have to work so hard. We all

thought we all wish we were charging a hundred thousand a month. But,

I mean, it is true that it's significantly

less money to actually do podcast because, well,

it's not as built up. Plus, you also do get that niche because

and I think what PR people and marketers traditionally think is that

the bigger the number, the more awareness they get. But then it's not

the right awareness because yeah. Just because

your industry like, for example, marketing. Marketing is not as popular

as, say, like, gaming is. Like, gaming in general is gonna have a bigger

audience because you have young and old gamers. With marketing, you have a

very specific, smaller, specific group

because there's only a certain amount of marketers because there's only a certain amount of

businesses. And so I think for me, a lot of

PR marketers get it wrong saying that we should have this big audience and be

like, no. You you have the right audience.

So in what ways do p podcast PR

help establish thought leadership more effective way than traditional

PR? More time to really share

your knowledge, to share what you've learned, what you do, how you

do it, why you do it, then, you know, if if you were going

on a two minute TV interview where you don't

get to share all of this. You get a big stage, but is

it really going to promote what you know, who you are,

and all of that? This is and this is also where you get to reach

other people. You don't know who's listening. You have no idea who

could be listening to this podcast right now, and it could be the

one person who goes, oh, yes. I not only wanna work with you. Maybe you

need to write a book. Maybe you need to do a TED talk. Maybe you

need to have your own show. There could be somebody listening who is

going to help elevate you to that next level. And the more

people you reach out to and they get to hear

all of your knowledge, then that promotes you as the thought leader.

This is putting yourself out there, and that's why it's so important to

share these interviews, to repurpose them so that people

can see and hear from you in all of these different ways

of yeah. You know what? Michelle knows what she's talking about because she keeps appearing

on these podcasts, and she's talking about podcast interviews. And

so that then presents you and

elevates you as the thought leader, as the expert in

whatever industry niche that you are in because you keep

showing up, you keep talking about it, and people hear that

repetition in a good way. Not in a, oh, boy. She's talking about it

again. Here we go. But, yeah, she's been invited on this show because

she knows what she's talking about because she is talking about podcast

interviews. And then just moving on to content

wise because, I mean, traditional PR does have its

place, but I feel like with podcast PR, you have

you can have a blog post about your episode. You can have the audio, the

video, the shorts, the audiograms. Like, it

seems like there's a longer tail of content that you could

repurpose through PR podcast PR than actual

traditional PR. Absolutely. You know, if

you're getting on TV and you've got that two minute clip, then there you go.

There's your two minute clip, and you got probably one quote. Whereas

if you're on a podcast, you do have, some cases, video.

You always have the audio. That's going to live forever on all

of the the podcast platforms. There are show notes that you

can put into a blog post. There are, you know, tweets that you can

do on x. You can put a thread on. You can do it on Instagram.

You can do a story. You can do a reel. You can do a post.

You know, right there, there's three different pieces of content. Then you can use

Facebook. Use Pinterest. There's so many different ways. I

also create a Spotify playlist for all of my clients to put

all of your shows, your interviews in one spot. That one

playlist can then be embedded on your website, on your press page.

It can be put onto your LinkedIn, under your media, for your current

job. There's so many different ways that you can repurpose

content. You know, we pull a transcript for every

client interview, and then we highlight the quotes of this

was a really good thing you said you should make it into a quote graphic.

You know, stop quoting famous people or celebrities, quote yourself.

So that way people see that you are the thought leader, and you're also

thanking the host because you're promoting their podcast by

mentioning them and giving them a plug as well. So

it's a it's a double whammy of promoting yourself in a non

sleazy way while also thanking your host for having you

and hopefully bringing them more listeners as well. And what metrics should

we be using? Now I do know as a podcaster myself,

podcasting metrics aren't the best. I do think they need to

change. I think downloads is a very simplistic

way of gauging the how invested the

audience is. I do think time spent is probably a better metric,

but we're we're still here. So I'll just let I'll let the metric people try

to figure that out. But, I mean, what metrics should they be using?

We look across the board at, you know, how many reviews do they have on

Apple? Do they have some on Spotify? We also then look at,

I have Podchaser, so I can see the approximate downloads,

listens. But unless you pay for that, you don't get to see that. You can

look at listen notes, which I I I love

and hate listen notes because I think that, you know, I'm in the top 2%.

Well, it's not that hard to get in the top 2% because as long as

you're consistent, you're showing up, and you're promote you're doing an episode, then you

basically get in that top 5% of podcast because, like

you said, most aren't making it past the third episode. The

other thing we look at is social media. You know, do they have a following

on Instagram? And if they have 10,000 followers, let's look

at a post because out of 10,000 followers, only three people are liking their

posts. So maybe they bought those followers. You know, now you can

buy reviews. I I get Apple Podcast promoters in

my LinkedIn stuff all day long. So everything

can be bought now, which is unfortunate, and that's why we look

at all of the different platforms to see, is it

consistent? You know, if a show has a thousand

reviews, well, how many followers do they have on Instagram? And does

that correlate to each other? So we look at everything to kind

of get a bigger picture of, is this legit? Isn't

it, you know, and then simply reading the description. I

think people forget to just read the description of the show to see who is

the target audience and look at that. Don't get so hung up

on numbers. You know, this would also come into

play if someone asks you to pay to be a guest on their

show because I have found that those who want

money, and I do not pay, do not pay to be a podcast

guest, do not pay for traditional PR placement.

That's advertising either way. And if a podcast host

says, well, you know, I've got a million downloads, and I I do this, do

that, go to their YouTube. Do they actually have subscribers there? And it will

tell you how many views they get. These are public things that you can look

at. So it takes some extra work, some due diligence, but

there are certain numbers that you can look at and identify and get a good

feel for. Is this truly accurate or not? Yeah.

The bane of my existence is podcast promoters. I swear I get so I got,

like, five of them a day, and it's very, very annoying. I never

respond to them. I never follow them, and I never will

because I do not want that headache. Yeah. It's

them. And do you wanna grow your Instagram by 10,000 followers?

Yeah. Like, all of that, I'm like, stop it. Or on YouTube or

Rumble, it's the same thing. Do you wanna grow this? I see you get less

things. I'm like, yeah. I'm growing my channel, dude. Like, it doesn't happen

overnight. Yeah. Organic growth is is much better

than purchasing followers. Yeah. So

yeah. Look at the podcaster. Usually, most podcasters will never

make you pay or any of that. I don't do it, and we

usually never use, like, the spam stuff because we all know that

it hurts in the long run. Yeah. And if if they do

want you to pay and you're willing to pay despite

being advised not to pay, you know, pay attention also. Are they

letting their audience know that this guest has paid to be on

their show? Because there are rules and regulations per the government

that they have to let the audience know that this is a

paid guest, just like with advertising on

TV because it is advertising. So, you know, we

we need this is it's the the wild, wild west is podcast where

it's great that we have so much flexibility, but at the same time,

some people are abusing it. And at some point, there will be

crackdowns, you know, for that type of a thing. So if

you're paying, pay attention to what is the host saying, and

are they disclosing it? Unfortunately, it's always a

smaller group that ruins it for everybody else.

But I'm speaking about how how does the targeting

capability of PR podcasts compare to traditional PR

methods? You can get much deeper in who you're

targeting. You know, I work with a lot of authors, so we

look at what is your book about, who is going to read your book. Now

what types of podcasts are they listening to? You know, are the Beach

Reads all a bunch of moms that are listening? Then let's target the mom

podcast. You can get much deeper, much more specific when

it comes to podcasts versus traditional

PR. You know, there are going to be places and

blogs and, magazines and digital outlets that you

can target a more specific audience, but

podcast can truly dig down. I the call I was

on just before this, we were talking about a romantacy podcast where

they literally only talk to romance,

authors. So you get very targeted. Those are the people who are listening.

They they want to hear the those authors because those are the books they're

reading. You can't do that really on TV. So

it becomes much more specific, and that's a great thing because you

get to reach the audience that you want to. And

what do you think what types of businesses or individuals benefit from

podcast PR? Because I always say not everybody should

start a podcast, but everybody should be a guest.

I agree, because there's a lot of reasons why not everybody should start one.

One of them is you have to be consistent. You have to show up.

With being a podcast guest, you do need to show up by all means.

You need to, you know, be professional. You need to have your setup for your

audio and your video. But I agree that everybody can

benefit from being a podcast guest because we all have a story to share.

We all have some sort of a pivot that's brought us to where we are.

We all have a reason why we do what we do. Why do

you wake up in the morning excited to do your job? Why did

you write the book that you wrote? What parts of you are in

that book? What is it about your team that

they show up every day for work? You know, what type of clients

are you working with? What type of knowledge do you have? Do

you do you have tips that you can share with somebody about what you

do for work that you can then help someone else do

it too? You're not gonna put yourself out of a job. You're simply sharing

that knowledge. And somebody who listens to a podcast where you're

sharing what you do and how you do it, they're gonna go, oh, that

was great that Michelle shared how to pitch a podcast, and

she did that for free. So imagine then what's going to happen when

you work with me and you pay me to do this for you, how

worthwhile that will be. It's a way to allow people to get to

know you, and yet it's also a comfortable, relaxed setting because

it's just a conversation between two people that everyone gets to

eavesdrop on. So for people who are, you know, more introverted

and don't wanna take the stage, this is a great way to simply have a

one on one conversation with another human being, be

yourself, show up, and yet you're going to also reach

hundreds, thousands, potentially millions of people by doing

podcast interviews. And if you have a good podcast host, it won't even

feel like it's like an interview because it will really be a good

conversation. So always find a good podcast host because they will

guide you as opposed to their learning podcast

host. I'll just say that they're learning how to do it. Like, just find that

one that will help you guide through because we are really guides to this

interview style. Exactly. Yes. And, you you know,

I think a good host is going to be able to read the body

language, to hear the voice of, oh, you know what? This person's nervous,

so let me talk about this instead. Or maybe,

you know, there's another question that I can ask. And that's why it's so important

for both parts to do their homework, you know, to do their research

on who they're interviewing and for the guests to do

their research on who they're being interviewed by. So that way you get

a more comfortable feeling when you show up versus, you know, meeting someone in the

coffee line and saying, hey. Nice shirt. That's

it. You don't know the person. But if you do some

stalking ahead of time, then at least you know that you can have a a

question or two in your back pocket. I always appreciate someone saying

nice shirt, but, I mean, if you see me, more power to you. If you

dealt to me, I'll be like, oh, thank you.

Anyways, in what ways can the podcast

PR be integrated with a comprehensive strategy with traditional? Because I feel like

these can two be very there there can be a lot of symmetry

between them because of the different natures of them.

Can be. And I think that both is is a great strategy.

You know? It it's just that you need to make sure that whoever's pitching you

understands the differences because it can't be the same

type of pitch, the same format for both of them. So

it does take more work and effort on the part of

the publicist. I've worked with PR companies, agencies

where they've brought me in to do the podcast part because it

is so different. And, you know, that's very helpful for the

client to get two experts who know what to do

and how to do it and, you know, team up, but at the same time,

go our separate ways and get the job done. So definitely

integrate both. You know, we would have weekly team meetings of,

okay. Where are you and and did this angle work? You know, there's this breaking

news that might be applicable to you. But, again, podcasting

is much more long term. So we're not going to

we might get a yes on a pitch, and then the calendar link isn't open

for two more months. And then you record, and it's another month before it comes

out. So breaking news is not really the way

to go for podcasts unless you are getting on one of those breaking news podcasts

where they are doing something every single day. So it's a much

longer game. The same can be said for traditional PR. You

might not get a placement for six months to a year. But at least with

a podcast, you're getting a yes. You're getting a calendar link much sooner.

It's just that nobody can guarantee when this is all going to happen.

It's true. I mean, I a lot of times, it's months ahead

for what I'm actually doing because, I mean, you get a lot of guests. You

prerecord all this stuff. So and plus mine's not timely at

all. I mean, we talk about marketing and PR, and, yes, there's some new

trends, but they're not traditional marketing and traditional PR

is always gonna be the same. There's nothing different about it. Yeah.

And some like to you know, I love to batch record. I love to be

able to get ahead, especially if the summer months are coming or, you know, the

holidays are around the corner. Right now, I'm into the October, and

we're recording this in the September. So, you know,

if you have something that needs to come out, October 1

for my show, you're too late because it's already done. So you have to

plan ahead. And you could also ask the host if they

can move it up too, because a lot of them will be like, okay. That's

fine. I can rearrange things, but don't expect and I've

had some guests be like, oh, so when is it coming up? And be like,

I told you it's been several months. Let the process work out. I

will let you know when it it gets released. Don't badger me because then you're

gonna make me mad. Right. And then it'll never come out.

Imagine that, because there's that too. It could be

that, you know, and that's on both ends, traditionally and podcasts that something

happens and maybe a show stops airing and there goes

that interview. You know, it it could be that breaking news happened and

there went your interview over there. So, yeah, it can

happen. And, I mean, can you use the role

of AI within podcast PR? I mean, we're gonna have to talk about it

because everybody's using AI. I will admit that I do use

AI to help me automate a lot of this stuff. Can you use that for

research and maybe either our first draft pitch or to help

you clarify pitches? Is that does that

work? I've tested it. I've I've told AI

to pitch myself to my own show,

and I was surprised at what it regurgitated because it said that I

had been interviewed places that I've never been interviewed.

So you and and AI tells you, you know, fact check it. So

there are some errors. I would say don't use it because you need

to personalize it. You need to listen.

The times when I do use it might be if I need a bio

changed for a client because they've given it to me in first person, and I

want it changed to third person. If I have topic

ideas that I'm not feeling as creative with my

words than to throw in what I already have created

and ask it to, you know, make it sound more professional or be more

creative or do something to that extent, then I will use

it. But I I rarely copy and paste

it word for word. I change it even then some more. So for me, it's

more of a brainstorming. What do I have? I love the you know,

to use it as a process. I do use it for my show, like, for

show notes, because there's already a format. Just pull,

you know, things together, that type of a thing. But, again, the

content's already created. It's just, you know, formatting

it in a in a nicer way. So that's when I would use it,

but not to write a pitch. I know there are agencies who are using it

for pitch writing, and I cringe be because I've tested it, and I I don't

like it. Eventually. But right now, yes.

Check all your stuff, reread it over, change it minorly if you

do. I do think they are getting better, but I don't think they're there yet.

Yeah. I I still think there's a ways to go. And

what are some of the challenges that podcast PR

may face that traditional PR doesn't face at all?

Oh, that's a good question. You

know, with podcasts, we're it's changing. It's always because it

is even though it's been around for over two decades, it's

still new. It's still, you know, question people question,

oh, well, is it going away? Is it growing? And, you know, with

the pandemic, we saw podcasts grow immensely

of new shows coming on, but then you also saw shows fall off

because we were all stuck at home and people who had a studio didn't know

how to record at home. And then you saw people who have kids who

went, oh, now I can't record because there's too much noise. We've got homeschooling

and all of that. So not knowing what the future is

going to hold, you don't know. I think it's going to continue to

grow. I think that we see, you know, Spotify.

We see iHeart. We see more deals continue to be done

with celebrity hosts. We see more true crime

popping up. It's growing. I don't think it's going anywhere.

So in that sense, I think that a podcast publicist is in a great

spot. We do see more of the automation, the AI, you know,

more of these, websites where you can

just sign up and be a guest, and that's it. But are

those shows going to stick around too? So I think it's important

to continue that personalized touch, for a podcast

publicist to make sure that that doesn't go away,

and and for those to be replaced per se.

It is true. Unfortunately, a lot of times, it changes a little too quickly where

Google just decides to take away things and move things around.

And from Google if people don't know, from Google Podcast

to YouTube Music, that's been, like, the biggest headache is Google

decides to make something and then do away with it, then you have to pivot

because it's Google. Right. So don't put all your eggs in one

basket. This is true. But, yeah, it is it is changing.

Spotify added comments. So if you wanna comment on this podcast,

be be sure to do it. They also added video to it so you

can now upload videos. So there's a lot of things changing. We are pushing into

video a little bit more, which for better than worst,

that's just how it is. I mean, you just kinda have to roll with the

punches or figure out how to do a better job with just your audio if

you want to. So, I mean,

where do, where do you think, like we're going with

podcast, PR or podcast in general? Are we going to see more

podcasts, more niching going on? Because I mean, the future is

still up in the air. It is growing. I mean, I've seen all the numbers.

The numbers always say it's growing. It's not growing as fast as it was during

the pandemic, but that's because it's a different we're back into the

somewhat normal settings where people go out and have jobs. So

where is the future going? Is it gonna be more video

centric podcast and less about audio,

or is audio still gonna play a really big role on it? I think audio

is still gonna play a really big role. I think that not everybody's pivoting

to video, because no you know, who's

sitting down and has time to watch? It's it's the same thing with television. You

know? Are you watching all of your shows? Are you streaming them?

You know, there there's a difference in all of that. So I think the audio

is still going to be extremely relevant. It's not going

anywhere. You will see more videos. And if you wanna watch the

videos and watch the interview, then, you know, that's great. Or maybe you wanna match

the face to the voice, then you can go and and look at even

the episode art if you want to or the video to see how

that person interacts. But I think it's only going to

grow more. I I think that we will see more shows. We'll probably see

more networks. And I think that it's it's a great opportunity

for people who are not celebrities to have

a platform to highlight their knowledge, to

show that they can interview somebody else as a guest on a show.

I I think that we're gonna see more and more of that. And so

it's only going to elevate more. Podcasts are not they're not

gonna go anywhere. They will see more growth. We will see more

sponsors. I think that people are understanding that it doesn't

have to be a huge show, again, because of that

specialization of you can reach exactly who you want

to. And so people are going to sponsor that type of a thing

versus, you know, a Super Bowl ad for a million dollars for two

seconds. And you're reaching a lot of people, but are they your people?

And podcasts allow you to reach your people. And so I think it's going

to grow across the board with more shows. People are going to

understand that you need to be a guest, so we'll see more guests, more pitches

for better or for worse, and we'll see more sponsors.

Gotcha. And people listen to this episode, they're wondering where can they find you online

to learn more about what you do and podcast PR in general? Thank you.

My website is themlgcollective.com. You can

find me on Instagram at Michelle Glogovac. You can

also purchase my book anywhere you purchase books. How to Get on

Podcasts is available. There's an audiobook. So if you love listening to

me, you can listen to me read the book to you as well. And my

show, My Simplified Life, is everywhere you listen to podcasts.

And any final thoughts for listeners? Put yourself out

there. You know? I think that podcasts allow us to get to know

people that we wouldn't otherwise hear from. And so that's why

it's really important to be a guest, to, you know,

let people know that you are out there, you know what you're doing, to share

your story. And so don't be afraid to

put yourself out there as a guest and and let hosts know that

you appreciate what they do as well because they're connecting you with people

that you might never have heard of or have gotten to meet on the street

or in the coffee shop unless they say nice shirt.

Fair enough. Well, thank you, Michelle, for joining Digital Coffee Marketing Brew and

sharing your knowledge on podcast PR versus traditional PR.

You so much for having me, Brett. And thank you for listening. As always,

please subscribe to this podcast on all your favorite podcasting. Absolutely, a five star review.

It will just help with the rankings. Let me know how I am doing. And

join me next week as I talk to another great thought leader in the PR

marketing industry. Alright, guys. Stay safe. Get to understanding podcasts and podcast

PR if you have never heard it before. And see you next week.

Later.